additional answers
We would like to thank you for increasing the score after our first answer. For completeness, we wanted to add answers to the other questions that you raised. We are happy to discuss more if you have any additional questions.
> 5. It would be interesting to try data-dependent decays proposed in Gated Linear Attention.
We actually tried this previously and noticed only a slight difference.
- 1B SUPRA; 10B RW tokens; HellaSwag = 57.0
- 1B GLA; 10B RW tokens; HellaSwag = 57.6
We believe the data dependent decay suffers from the same problem as fixed decay, which we mention in the paper (decays too fast and does not allow long context attention). We are continuing to look into this for future work, but this would require a thorough study of gating mechanisms and is out of the scope of this current work.
> 1. In table1, it seems that continual training for more tokens could bridge the gap between linear and softmax attention.
As training is pushed from 20B tokens to 70B tokens, the results do improve (Table 1). They would probably improve further with even longer training. However, training for more tokens would bring the cost closer to pretraining. In our experiments, our approach seems most relevant in the context of uptraining with a modest compute budget. With more available compute, it is likely that other approaches such as Mamba would yield better results at lower cost and would therefore be preferable.
> 2. In table3, why do you only report the results of HellaSwag and ARC? Do you have a specific reason? What about other metrics?
For Table 3, we only considered 1B models for ablations. Since 1B models are weaker than the 7B models in Table 1, we opted to evaluate on easier test sets such as HellaSwag and ARC. Evaluating on a difficult set like MMLU would not be very meaningful because the results are just close to random guessing.
> 4. It would be interesting to use the attention distillation loss proposed in Hedgehog for learning the feature map?
Thank you for bringing this up! We were aware of the Hedgehog paper and in fact cited it in our related work. However, **there is no released code** beyond the pseudocode attached to the paper. This made it time-consuming to implement and test, but we agree that it is an interesting baseline and will try to include it in our camera ready version.
More specifically, a naive implementation of their approach would require two full computations of the attention matrices to compute the loss that the authors introduce. This is known to be memory intensive and we would not be able to train at scale with this approach without an involved implementation of memory efficient attention with an added attention loss.
Furthermore, in our Appendix, we show that our trained SUPRA matrices do not actually approximate the softmax matrices. The RetNet paper shows how the normalization of the attention factor that allows to approximate the softmax can lead to instabilities. When uptraining 1B models, we did experience these instabilities in practice. Thus, while we lack the experiments that would give a definitive answer to your question, we believe that the Hedgehog approach of trying to very closely approximate softmax may not be the correct approach for uptraining such linear models at scale.
Unfortunately, the Hedgehog paper does not publish evaluations on the common benchmarks like HellaSwag, ARC, and PIQA which does not allow a direct comparison of our respective results.
> 3. Could you release an anonymous huggingface repo for the 7B mamba model?
Yes, we plan to release our models and code together with this submission. For the 7B mamba, we have created an anonymous model on Hugging Face https://huggingface.co/mambacolm/mambacolm
Thanks as well for including the missing references! We will include these in the final version of the paper.